Replacing a Hive

You need some help attaching the thermostat to your specific boiler. This way please !
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andy@2610.co.uk
Posts: 7
Joined: 01 Jan 2019, 20:12

Replacing a Hive

Post by andy@2610.co.uk » 07 Feb 2019, 22:05

I've just got my Netatmo Thermostat in the hope that I could replace my Hive Thermostat but have fallen at the first fence.

It's quite an old boiler (Glowworm 45F) with a separate hot water tank. The Hive controls the heating and the hot water so the receiver that connects to the boiler has a button for heating and a button for hot water. I just took the cover off in the hope that it would be a simple swap and this is where it's gone wrong. This is the connections on the Hive receiver:

N
L
Hot water off (NC)
Heating off (NC)
Hot water on (NO)
Heating on (NO)

At the moment, there's a 2 core cable with black and red connected to the Live and Neutral so that bit's obvious.

Then there's a 3 core cable with red going to the hot water off (NC), yellow going to hot water on (NO), blue going to heating on (NO) and nothing going to heating off (NC).

Have I come unstuck, or is there a solution?

GEORGzer
Posts: 1247
Joined: 14 Jan 2014, 18:14

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by GEORGzer » 08 Feb 2019, 07:46

You won't be able to fully replace your old controller, since the Netatmo Thermostat can only control heating but not hot water.

I suppose your old controller closes a circuit between L and NO to start the heating (you would have to test that theory somehow). If so, you either have to connect those two wires (splitting L so your old controller keeps working) to the Netatmo Thermostat.
Or you connect the Netatmo Relaise blue wire to N, brown and black wire to L and grey wire to NO. But this would be something to do on the boiler’s side so you won't have a wire-mess in your livingroom (or whereever your current controller is located).


Does this Hive look like the one on the right?
https://community.screwfix.com/proxy.ph ... fcb6bd21e8
Home:Weather Station (V3 + Rain Gauge, Wind Gauge, 3 additional Indoor Modules), Valves Starter Pack + 5 additional Valves, Smart Video Doorbell
Office: Thermostat (V2), Healthy Home Coach, Smart Smoke Alarm

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andy@2610.co.uk
Posts: 7
Joined: 01 Jan 2019, 20:12

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by andy@2610.co.uk » 08 Feb 2019, 09:07

Ok, thank you for that. I thought about the hot water last night and came to this conclusion. I just assumed all these things did the same thing. My plan is probably to leave the Hive controller in place just for the hot water. We have the hot water on constant anyway so I can just put the old Hive thermostat out of the way somewhere.

Your last suggestion sounds realistic:
Or you connect the Netatmo Relaise blue wire to N, brown and black wire to L and grey wire to NO. But this would be something to do on the boiler’s side so you won't have a wire-mess in your livingroom (or whereever your current controller is located).
The controller is in a cupboard so I'm not too worried about the wiring being a bit messy. Most of it it hidden behind a wooden panel anyway. The wires on the Hive controller go into a junction box underneath. I didn't realise that until I looked later. I just thought the junction box was left from the old timer and controller. So I can follow the cables from the Hive controller and connect the Netatmo ones in there.

Just to confirm then...

N - Leave this connected as it powers the Hive. Also connect the blue from the Netatmo relay
L - Leave this connected as it powers the Hive. Also connect the brown from the Netatmo relay AND the black from the Netatmo relay
Hot water off (NC) - Leave this connected as it controls the hot water. Nothing from the Netatmo
Heating off (NC) - Leave this as there's nothing on there anyway
Hot water on (NO) - Leave this connected as it controls the hot water. Nothing from the Netatmo
Heating on (NO) - Disconnect this to stop the Hive trying to control the heating. Connect the grey wire from the Netatmo

All the Netatmo connections will be made in the junction box, not using the connectors in the Hive controller.

Thank you for your help on this!

GEORGzer
Posts: 1247
Joined: 14 Jan 2014, 18:14

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by GEORGzer » 08 Feb 2019, 09:13

Exactly. On the site I found the graphic was a discussion about connecting some other smart thermostat and they basically confirmed that the Hive just connects the NO to the live wire L to start the heating. So my described wiring should be correct.

On a side note: if your current thermostat controller is in a cupboard, won‘t affect this the temperature readings?
Home:Weather Station (V3 + Rain Gauge, Wind Gauge, 3 additional Indoor Modules), Valves Starter Pack + 5 additional Valves, Smart Video Doorbell
Office: Thermostat (V2), Healthy Home Coach, Smart Smoke Alarm

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andy@2610.co.uk
Posts: 7
Joined: 01 Jan 2019, 20:12

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by andy@2610.co.uk » 08 Feb 2019, 09:30

Cool. That's the direction I'll go in then.

Sorry, I forgot to say that I just get a broken image when I followed the link you posted to the Screwfix site so I'm not sure if it's right. Sounds like you've found what I could have found myself if I knew what I was searching for so apologies for that. I've tried all sorts of searches but I just get articles about different smart thermostats.

At the moment, the thermostat is in the lounge. The wiring diagram I've been talking about is for the wireless receiver and that's in the cupboard upstairs. So I guess it works in the same way as the Netatmo. Thermostat talks to the controller wirelessly and the controller talks to the boiler with wires. So my Netatmo thermostat will be in the lounge and the relay will be in the cupboard next to the Hive receiver.

GEORGzer
Posts: 1247
Joined: 14 Jan 2014, 18:14

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by GEORGzer » 08 Feb 2019, 09:40

I understand.
Sorry about the broken link, it works for me though. Seems some kind of PHP problem.

I was talking about this graphic.
759365BC-5111-4B2E-803A-6A61B05605C1.jpeg
Home:Weather Station (V3 + Rain Gauge, Wind Gauge, 3 additional Indoor Modules), Valves Starter Pack + 5 additional Valves, Smart Video Doorbell
Office: Thermostat (V2), Healthy Home Coach, Smart Smoke Alarm

Not a Netatmo employee

andy@2610.co.uk
Posts: 7
Joined: 01 Jan 2019, 20:12

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by andy@2610.co.uk » 08 Feb 2019, 10:26

Yep, that looks like the one.

Not sure if this will work but this should be a couple of photos. One of the inside of the Hive controller and one of the inside of the junction box.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/r ... 0o3jcf66i6

On the junction box one, the top left has the live and neutral going out to the Hive controller. Top dead centre is where the red, blue and yellow come from the Hive controller into the junction box. You can see that the blue connects to a white wire that goes back out, the yellow to a red wire and the red joins a blue wire and goes out to a grey wire. Looks like a right mess with blues and reds going to the same place! So, apart from adding in the power and black for the Netatmo relay, I'll just disconnect that blue wire and replace it with the grey wire from the Netatmo.

Then the fun begins :) This all started because my other half bought me the weather station for Christmas. I've added the rain gauge. Valves next. Not sure about the other stuff yet. I've built my own cameras using Pi Zeros and they work brilliantly. What I'm most looking forward to is seeing how the weather station interacts with the heating.

andy@2610.co.uk
Posts: 7
Joined: 01 Jan 2019, 20:12

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by andy@2610.co.uk » 08 Feb 2019, 16:04

Thanks for your help on this. It is 100% safe to say that I wouldn't have managed that without your instructions!

All *seems* to be working. If I turn it up, the boiler comes on. If I turn it down, the boiler goes off. Can't ask for much more at this stage.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/photos/share/O ... zXllvAIg72

GEORGzer
Posts: 1247
Joined: 14 Jan 2014, 18:14

Re: Replacing a Hive

Post by GEORGzer » 08 Feb 2019, 19:47

;)
Home:Weather Station (V3 + Rain Gauge, Wind Gauge, 3 additional Indoor Modules), Valves Starter Pack + 5 additional Valves, Smart Video Doorbell
Office: Thermostat (V2), Healthy Home Coach, Smart Smoke Alarm

Not a Netatmo employee

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